I would like to claim a 3 point distance flight according to 1.4.2f. A COURSE from a RELEASE POINT or a declared START POINT to any type of FINISH POINT, via one, two, or three declared TURN POINTS, which may be flown in any order.

Although one MAY declare a start or finish, there is a great advantage not to. After making the last turnpoint, one only has to find clear air to make the last leg as long as possible. With a defined finish there will be a thunderstorm in the way, guaranteed.

I can't figure out how to enter the declaration into my clear nav or even seeyou without a start and finish.

What am I missing here?

On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 7:21:36 PM UTC-5, xcnick wrote:
> I would like to claim a 3 point distance flight according to 1.4.2f. A COURSE from a RELEASE POINT or a declared START POINT to any type of FINISH POINT, via one, two, or three declared TURN POINTS, which may be flown in any order.
>
> Although one MAY declare a start or finish, there is a great advantage not to. After making the last turnpoint, one only has to find clear air to make the last leg as long as possible. With a defined finish there will be a thunderstorm in the way, guaranteed.
>
> I can't figure out how to enter the declaration into my clear nav or even seeyou without a start and finish.
>
> What am I missing here?

Enter a task that consists of a start, 1, 2 or 3 turn points and a finish. Fly your task. Post flight: determine your best soaring performance (see the B&R guide) based on the better of a) your release from tow or b) your declared start. Your "declared" finish point is irrelevant for 3TP distance, your point of furthest progress from the last turn determines the record distance. Your declared start is irrelevant if you choose to use your release from tow. Other variations are possible. For instance you could use the declared start/finish and 3 turns to define a triangle (for speed or distance or both) and extend the flight past the finish to claim a 3TP distance based on release from tow and landing all on same flight.

Even more interesting variations used to be possible, for instance releasing from tow in one state and declaring a remote start in another, but sadly, for reasons never explained, the B&R committee added a one state per flight rule (while still encouraging other types of parallel claims).

Can provide example flights / declarations / B&R docs if interested.

T8

On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 7:21:36 PM UTC-5, xcnick wrote:
> I would like to claim a 3 point distance flight according to 1.4.2f. A COURSE from a RELEASE POINT or a declared START POINT to any type of FINISH POINT, via one, two, or three declared TURN POINTS, which may be flown in any order.
>
> Although one MAY declare a start or finish, there is a great advantage not to. After making the last turnpoint, one only has to find clear air to make the last leg as long as possible. With a defined finish there will be a thunderstorm in the way, guaranteed.
>
> I can't figure out how to enter the declaration into my clear nav or even seeyou without a start and finish.
>
> What am I missing here?
I got really irritated and wrapped around the axle when they started mandating electronic decs, because of just this issue. The answer I got was that you still make the electronic dec, but also do a paper dec with the finish listed as To Be Decided. Also do not number your turn points on the paper dec before flight if you may want the option to change the order, skip, or repeat. Your observer will witness the post-flight numbering and finish point as flown.

Thanks guys. I was beginning to think I was crazy.

I immediately reached for the paper work around but it says for diamond and diploma one must use the FR.

I understand declaring a start and finish but not using them. I just hope the badge dude does. This is what I will do.

Please send all you can. I asked on the ClearNav forum as well. I am so lost. If I start a route, is that also a “declaration”?

Just to clarify XCNick - You are trying to set a record for the Free Distance up to 3 Turnpoints? If so, I agree with the previous comments.

It is my understanding that the declared (not free) Distance up to 3 Turnpoints records require the Start, Finish, and any Turnpoints to be declared in your FR.

Lou

On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 9:44:19 PM UTC-5, xcnick wrote:
> Thanks guys. I was beginning to think I was crazy.
>
> I immediately reached for the paper work around but it says for diamond and diploma one must use the FR.
>
> I understand declaring a start and finish but not using them. I just hope the badge dude does. This is what I will do.
>
> Please send all you can. I asked on the ClearNav forum as well. I am so lost. If I start a route, is that also a “declaration”?

ClearNav 2 (but not CNv) "declares" whatever task is active at take off. Any task changes you make in flight do not affect the declaration. CNv works a little differently, you must declare the task you want declared on the ground, then that declaration remains active until superseded.

I have had nothing but great service from Rollin our badge dude.

T8

No, 750 Diploma with no need for a finish. I see this falling under the paragraphs of not being able to achieve the declaration but still being able to earn a lesser badge. The route, which I hope is also a declaration, is an overachievement of what I really want. My only race will be with the sun.

On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 9:50:54 PM UTC-5, MNLou wrote:
> Just to clarify XCNick - You are trying to set a record for the Free Distance up to 3 Turnpoints? If so, I agree with the previous comments.
>
> It is my understanding that the declared (not free) Distance up to 3 Turnpoints records require the Start, Finish, and any Turnpoints to be declared in your FR.
>
> Lou

Declared 3TP distance can use either release from tow or a declared start, up to three declared turnpoints, finish is -not- declared.

Free 3TP distance is just that: nothing need be declared.

T8

On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 6:55:33 PM UTC-8, tango:
CNv works a little differently, you must declare the task you want declared on the ground, then that declaration remains active until superseded.

does this mean that if I change the go to on the CNv I loose the declaration?

Free turnpoint doesn't work for diploma. You nailed it before. Thanks so much. I embaressed to say how long this has been bothering me. At first it reads as simple as my divorce, and then it all goes really bad. I am not worried about Rollin, me however...

On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 10:05:20 PM UTC-5, xcnick wrote:
> On Wednesday, March 3, 2021 at 6:55:33 PM UTC-8, tango:
> CNv works a little differently, you must declare the task you want declared on the ground, then that declaration remains active until superseded.
> does this mean that if I change the go to on the CNv I loose the declaration?

No, once the declaration is set in CNv, it's set for keeps. Use for navigation as you like.

A 750 diplome needs to be done to 3TP distance rules. Use release or declared start, up to 3 turn points (in any order), finish isn't declared, it's best fix. Free 3TP distance is a separate category for records.

T8